Argument 1.

A. Pauline Christianity suggests that original sin makes sin inevitable for everyone born "of man".

B. Pauline Christianity also suggests that 'god' sending people to hell is a just, proportionate and fair punishment for sinning and that everyone goes to hell as they deserve unless they 'go through Jesus'.

C. Christian conservatives propound the principle of personal responsibility as a virtue.

D. "Christian" is not defined as someone who turns the other cheek and loves his enemy; otherwise Mahatma Gandhi and Buddha would be Christians. A Christian  is defined as someone, for their own personal gain and profit, worshiping the torture and death of Jesus, a good and innocent man, so that they themselves can evade being sent to hell by the (sadistic) 'god' named Yahweh.

E1. Therefore conservative Christians should accept the responsibility of their own sin-debts to 'god' instead of having innocent Jesus pay for their sins with his blood. Instead of profiting from the torture and death of the good and innocent, they should be responsible enough to pay their own just debts and stop freeloading.
Conservative Christians should step up, pay their own debts and go to hell. 

E2. To be a Christian is irresponsible behavior, whether the Christian is conservative or not because they are abdicating responsibility for their own sins and want Jesus to pay for their sins for them with his blood and suffering (which I contend is also evil). 



Argument 2.

A. In Matthew 15, the Pharisees criticized Jesus for not washing his hands before breaking bread and Jesus responded that the Pharisees let their children be "lippy" and thereby break the 5th commandment, which is punishable by death. In Matthew 15:4, biblical Jesus said "let them die the death". 

B. Matthew 5:18 "For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled."

C. One of the prophesies to be fulfilled was Jesus' return, which has not happened yet so the Ten Commandments are still in effect (B).

D. Matthew 10:34-36, biblical Jesus said- "Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword. For I am come to set a man at variance against his father, and the daughter against her mother, and the daughter in law against her mother in law. And a man's foes shall be they of his own household."

E. Luke 14:26 biblical Jesus said-"If any man come to me, and hate not his father, and mother, and wife, and children, and brethren, and sisters, yea, and his own life also, he cannot be my disciple."

F. Therefore Jesus thinks his followers should "die the death" by being stoned to death because they will necessarily break the fifth commandment (D & E).




Argument 3.

A. If Jesus is loving and omni-benevolent and Jesus is 'god' and 'god' is omnipotent and omniscient, then 'god' is going to do the ultimate good that he can do for everyone whenever he needs to do anything. 

B. 'god' is omniscient and already knows what is in your heart and anything else you can possibly tell him. 

C. 'god' does not need you to tell him anything as if he doesn't already know it and 'god' does not need you to pray to him before he can speak to you.

D. The only purpose for prayer is not to commune (C), but because you want 'god' to do something for you other than the omni-benevolent thing he would have done anyway had you not prayed, and your selfish wishes and desires are "fallen" and shortsighted and therefore a relative evil compared to omni-benevolence.

E. Praying as opposed to not praying is a relative evil.

F. Therefore, prayer is evil.




Argument 4.

A. Morality requires moral choice.

B. Moral choice requires knowledge of good and evil.

C. Adam & Eve partaking of the "forbidden fruit" made them as the immortals, knowing good and evil (Genesis 3:22) and was also this thought and action that first Turtillian & then later St. Augustine (commenting on Pauline Christian interpretation) called "original sin".

D. Morality would be impossible for mankind if it were not for the thought and action deemed "original sin".

E. Therefore (M => S); and  (~S => ~M); or, "morality is inseparable from original sin" and if there was no sin then morality would be impossible.

F. Human morality is inseparable from human original sin and is therefore evil.

G. Therefore morality is evil. (In fact, there could be no morality without evil).



Argument 5.

A. In Genesis 4:1-8, 'god'-Yahweh 'respected' Able's killing of animals and offering 'god' the innocent's blood and fat but did not respect Cain's fruits and veggie offering. (I guess 'god' doesn't like broccoli). This pissed Cain off, so he killed Able.

B. Now that 'god'-Yahweh got a taste of the "blemish free" blood and fat of the innocent he demanded it quite a lot. Leviticus chapters 1-9 is about nothing else but how to appropriately rip open animals and sling their blood and entrails about at the altar.

C. The blood and fat is only for 'god' because he likes it (Leviticus 3:16 and in many other places in Leviticus 1-9).

D. Burning the sin offering offers "A sweet savour unto the Lord" (repeated over and over in Lev 1-9).

E. Human sacrifice: 2 Kings 23:20
Josiah "...slew all the priests of the high places that were there upon the altars, and burned men's bones upon them, and returned to Jerusalem."

F. 2 Kings 22:2
Josiah "...did that which was right in the sight of the LORD, and walked in all the way of David his father, and turned not aside to the right hand or to the left."

G. Judges 11:30-31
"And Jephthah vowed a vow unto the LORD, and said, If thou shalt without fail deliver the children of Ammon into mine hands, Then it shall be, that whatsoever cometh forth of the doors of my house to meet me, when I return in peace from the children of Ammon, shall surely be the LORD's, and I will offer it up for a burnt offering." 

H. Judges 11:32-33
"...and the LORD delivered them into his hands. And he smote them..."

I. (G & H) does not say that Jephthah won the battle on his own or that 'god'-Yahweh didn't like his offer, it says that Jephthah offered a human sacrifice if 'god'-Yahweh delivered the Ammonites into his hands and that 'god' complied with this delivery per the agreement.

J. Jephthah's daughter came out to greet him (Judges 11:34) so it was she who was going to be the human sacrifice to 'god'.

K. A big deal is made out of the fact that the human sacrifice to 'god'-Yahweh was a virgin.

L. Jephthah slaughtered his daughter in a human blood sacrifice burnt offering to 'god'-Yahweh who apparently wanted it (G & H).

M. Paul made a big deal out of Jephthah being a "hero of faith" in Hebrews 11:32 even though the only real mention of him is the human sacrifice of his daughter in Judges 11.

N. Hebrews 9:13-14
"For if the blood of bulls and of goats, and the ashes of an heifer sprinkling the unclean, sanctifieth to the purifying of the flesh, How much more shall the blood of Christ...?"

O. Hebrews 9:22
"...and without shedding of blood is no remission (forgiveness)".

P. Ephesians 5:2
"And walk in love, as Christ also hath loved us, and hath given himself for us an offering and a sacrifice to God for a sweetsmelling savour."

Q. 'god'-Yahweh is a powerful, vicious (and I would argue 'evil') immortal that likes the fat and especially the blood of the good and innocent, especially Jesus' whose blood has a "sweet savour" (A-P).

R. Therefore 'god'-Yahweh is a vampire.




Argument 6.

A. "Immortal" means to be indestructible and that nothing external to yourself or out of your control can (or will) aid or harm you without your consent. Since nothing can aid or harm you, then nothing external to yourself could be "good" or "bad", or "evil" to you personally while you maintain this immortal state of existence.

B. To be mortal is to be able to be harmed and able to be harmed to the extent that one can lose one's life.

C. If one considers some possible futures preferable to another (i.e. a future of bliss as opposed to a future of suffering), then goals and plans in a non-fated future logically have value to your life.

D. We seem to be generally able to affect our present and future. 

E. Since it is only the concept of human life that makes the concept of possessing human values possible, and since goals and plans are a value to our lives, then our lives have inherent worth to us as humans (and we logically have worth to ourselves other than being chattel for a deity).

F. Because of 'B' through 'E', (and indirectly 'A') external factors to our lives can be "good", "bad" or "evil" in reference to us maintaining our valued lives and can affect our possible futures.

E. Because we are mortal, possess a "precious" and fleeting value called life, and things can be good or bad to us, then to be free mortal beings relative evil must exist.

F. Therefore evil is necessary for free mortal beings.

(My counterargument to the argument from evil).



Argument 7:

A. Jesus' told his followers, "Pray this way" meaning the Lord's Prayer.

B. The "Lord's Prayer" included the words "...And forgive us our debts, as we forgive our debtors" (Matthew 6:12; KJV)

C. Within theory, Jesus' blood (paid for/atoned) to 'god' for the sins of the Christians (Hebrews 9:12).

D. Axiom: A debt that has been paid does not need to be forgiven.

E. Hebrews 9:22; "...and without shedding of blood is no forgiveness", (New American Bible).

F. A debt is either paid or not paid.

G. A debt paid AND a debt not paid cannot be forgiven by 'god' (D & E).

H. Therefore 'god' does not forgive.

I. Conclusion: Either Jesus was lying or Pauline Christianity is wrong (A & H).




LOGOS
Interesting Arguments
Go back to homepage
(The result of polemic pontifications and mulling hum-drum conundrums in the shower, LOL).
(Make note that these are logical arguments. I'm not saying that they are actual truth, i.e. facts about objective reality. I'm suggesting that as logical arguments they are valid as long as it is true that if the premises are all true then the conclusion is always necessarily true as well. What makes valid logical arguments interesting is that they are as true as any other 'truth'. If the 'true' conclusion is absurd, then there is something stinky in Denmark for the believer to deal with, or that they should deal with.)
Read/Write Comments about these arguments.